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patio inglés

English translation: sunken forecourt

GLOSSARY ENTRY (DERIVED FROM QUESTION BELOW)
Spanish term or phrase:patio inglés
English translation:sunken forecourt
Entered by: Justin Peterson

05:36 Feb 14, 2016
Spanish to English translations [PRO]
Architecture
Spanish term or phrase: patio inglés
A very clear explanation here in Spanish:

https://es.wikipedia.org/wiki/Patio_inglés

But what is it in English?

I do think it is an "English patio" (run an image search), a patio, front yard, or forecourt, the only specialised term I've found.
Justin Peterson
Spain
Local time: 16:36
sunken forecourt
Explanation:
I'd say "courtyard" if it didn't create too many false expectations.

In many cases (old buildings) it simply came about as the result of a rising street levels due to landfill.

--------------------------------------------------
Note added at 5 hrs (2016-02-14 10:49:27 GMT)
--------------------------------------------------

Sorry, "rising Street levels" without the "a"
Selected response from:

Parrot
Spain
Local time: 16:36
Grading comment
After looking at all the options ... I do think it is a "forecourt"
4 KudoZ points were awarded for this answer



Summary of answers provided
4 +4(front) area (UK) / areaway (US) / front basement yard
Charles Davis
3 +1sunken forecourt
Parrot
3opened semi-basement
Denis Zabelin
3porch or patio
patinba
Summary of reference entries provided
area
Yvonne Gallagher

Discussion entries: 12





  

Answers


3 hrs   confidence: Answerer confidence 4/5Answerer confidence 4/5 peer agreement (net): +4
(front) area (UK) / areaway (US) / front basement yard


Explanation:
In Britain it's simply called the "area". There is a consensus about this in the following discussion, with many British contributors agreeing that that's the word:

"What is the name of the sunken area in front of a Victorian terraced house?"
http://little-details.livejournal.com/3315528.html

"In architecture, an area (areaways in North America) is an excavated, subterranean space around the walls of a building, designed to admit light into a basement, often providing access to the house for tradesmen and deliveries and access to vaults beneath the pavement for storage of coal and ash."
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Area_(architecture)

"A subterranean lightwell at the front of a building to provide light to a basement is called an area (or areaway in North American usage)."
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lightwell#Area_or_areaway

I've never heard of an "areaway" myself and I can't vouch for it, but it may be used in American English.

But depending on the context "area" might not make the meaning clear. The more descriptive expression "front basement yard" is used in some British planning and estate agency sources:

"New stairway to access the front basement yard. | 13 Gerald Road London SW1W 9EH "
http://idoxpa.westminster.gov.uk/online-applications/applica...

"DESIGN ACCESS STATEMENT :
18 Belgrave Crescent, Bath, BA1 5JU
This application is for small single storey extension to the existing toilet facility in the front basement yard."
http://www.bathnes.gov.uk/WAM/doc/BackGround Papers-737018.p...

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Note added at 3 hrs (2016-02-14 08:52:51 GMT)
--------------------------------------------------

"English patio" would mean nothing to a British reader; at least, it wouldn't make me think of this sort of yard. "Forecourt" has a different meaning. "Front yard" alone doesn't imply a lower level. "Front lightwell" would be accurate, I suppose, though I don't think anyone would call it that.

--------------------------------------------------
Note added at 3 hrs (2016-02-14 09:08:24 GMT)
--------------------------------------------------

It's not always a basement; it can be a semi-basement, since the ground floor of houses that have these is quite often above street level. But we need a term that applies to a yard below ground level, since that's what "inglés" means, according to your Wikipedia page:

"Técnicamente no importa la cota del suelo del patio, siempre que esté bajo la rasante del terreno se denominará inglés."

Charles Davis
Spain
Local time: 16:36
Works in field
Native speaker of: English
PRO pts in category: 248

Peer comments on this answer (and responses from the answerer)
agree  neilmac: I remember hearing "patio" on US sitcoms as a child and wondering what the heck it was. Ditto "gazebo"...
16 mins
  -> I don't think I'd ever heard of patios back then either, and I still have to check what a gazebo is! There's no way anyone would call this a patio in Britain, IMO. Thanks, Neil :)
agree  Cristina Gonzalez: The term "patio inglés" is commonly used among Spanish architects to refer to this area.
6 hrs
  -> It makes it sounds quite picturesque. In practice, from my memory, these areas are often damp and messy. Thanks, Cristina :)
agree  patinba: Late, but for the record, I have just read an article by Penelope Lively in an old Spectator in which she states "The vault opens onto the area - mine is the last generation to know that is what you call the space between the basement and the pavement"
65 days
  -> Thanks, Pat, much appreciated :)
agree  Yvonne Gallagher: Also late to this but fully agree with "area" as does Joyce. I've posted a ref. for future searches.
169 days
  -> Well, that's good enough for me. Thanks, you've made my day!
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3 hrs   confidence: Answerer confidence 3/5Answerer confidence 3/5
opened semi-basement


Explanation:
Opinion

Denis Zabelin
Belarus
Local time: 17:36
Specializes in field
Native speaker of: Native in BelarusianBelarusian, Native in RussianRussian
PRO pts in category: 4
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5 hrs   confidence: Answerer confidence 3/5Answerer confidence 3/5 peer agreement (net): +1
sunken forecourt


Explanation:
I'd say "courtyard" if it didn't create too many false expectations.

In many cases (old buildings) it simply came about as the result of a rising street levels due to landfill.

--------------------------------------------------
Note added at 5 hrs (2016-02-14 10:49:27 GMT)
--------------------------------------------------

Sorry, "rising Street levels" without the "a"

Parrot
Spain
Local time: 16:36
Specializes in field
Native speaker of: English
PRO pts in category: 97
Grading comment
After looking at all the options ... I do think it is a "forecourt"

Peer comments on this answer (and responses from the answerer)
agree  Robert Carter: Forecourt is what I would call it, but as a said above, I'm not sure if it isn't just a regionalism. I would have said it's a "basement forecourt".
10 hrs
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1 day 6 hrs   confidence: Answerer confidence 3/5Answerer confidence 3/5
porch or patio


Explanation:
As you can see from asker's link, these are very small spaces designed to provide access to basement flats, with not much room for more than a flower-pot or two and the empty milk bottles. I think "yard" and "forecourt" would apply to much larger areas.

patinba
Argentina
Local time: 11:36
Native speaker of: Native in EnglishEnglish
PRO pts in category: 172
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Reference comments


169 days
Reference: area

Reference information:
Rather late to this but just for future reference...I fully agree with Charles and think of "forecourt" as something quite different and not sunken either.

The railed-off (semi-basement) area, particularly in front of Georgian (18th century) and Victorian (19th) houses with iron railings and often steps leading

Here is a particularly nice extract from "Ulysses" and what better recommendation for a word?! By the way, this episode is iin the form of catechism questions

http://www.online-literature.com/james_joyce/ulysses/17/

..."What action did Bloom make on their arrival at their destination?

At the housesteps of the 4th of the equidifferent uneven numbers, number 7 Eccles street, he inserted his hand mechanically into the back pocket of his trousers to obtain his latchkey.

Was it there?

It was in the corresponding pocket of the trousers which he had worn on the day but one preceding.

Why was he doubly irritated?

Because he had forgotten and because he remembered that he had reminded himself twice not to forget.

What were then the alternatives before the, premeditatedly (respectively) and inadvertently, keyless couple?

To enter or not to enter. To knock or not to knock.

Bloom's decision?

A stratagem. Resting his feet on the dwarf wall, he climbed over the area railings, compressed his hat on his head, grasped two points at the lower union of rails and stiles, lowered his body gradually by its length of five feet nine inches and a half to within two feet ten inches of the area pavement, and allowed his body to move freely in space by separating himself from the railings and crouching in preparation for the impact of the fall.

Did he fall?

By his body's known weight of eleven stone and four pounds in avoirdupois measure, as certified by the graduated machine for periodical selfweighing in the premises of Francis Fraedman, pharmaceutical chemist of 19 Frederick street, north, on the last feast of the Ascension, to wit, the twelfth day of May of the bissextile year one thousand nine hundred and four of the Christian era (jewish era five thousand six hundred and sixtyfour, mohammedan era one thousand three hundred and twentytwo), golden number $, epact 13, solar cycle 9, dominical letters C B, Roman indication 2, Julian period 6617, MXMIV...

Yvonne Gallagher
Ireland
Native speaker of: Native in EnglishEnglish
PRO pts in category: 28
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