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Italian to English translations [PRO] Slang / Dedication
Italian term or phrase:I "bagianell ch'a l'han piu bogin" dell'[firma] di Torino...
This is a dedication on the back of a picture presented to a colleague. The part in brackets seems to be in Piemontese dialect, or it may be a quote. Can anyone help me? NB I may have mistranscribed the 64-year-old scrawl so it may not be 100% accurate, but if anyone can help I'd be very grateful. This is a personal article, presented to my father, rather than a professional job.
As a terrona, I have to say that, unless many other Italians (I'm not going to name names...), the Torinesi don't make a song and a dance about their own countless and impressive achievements (first capital of united Italy, industrial innovation, political and social involvement at all levels, the cradle of Italian cinema, great cuisine, etc.). Bogianen can certainly mean conservative, cautious, and set-in-their-ways, but it means also steadfast, constant, loyal, reliable, a kind of "Keep calm and carry on" attitude, so unlikely that of their fellow Italians.
My friend is fairly sure about the word play on the verb "bogè", whether or not it is negated, but there are too many possible interpretations to be 100% certain.
Is there any change of Amanda posting a scanned image somewhere?
It's quite a charming version, but I'm not really sure about that; if it were like your friend says, the sentence should read: "I bogianen ch'a l'han bogià 'd pì". Ch'a l'han pì is a negative sentence in the Turin dialect (according to my husband, Turin-born and bred, and a speaker, though not an expert, of its dialect). I think Amanda's father could solve this "puzzle". Trying to read a scrawl is difficult but, I have to say, both versions have a certain ring to them.
The above Piedmontese proverb, quoted in Vittorio di Sant'Albino's 1859 Gran Dizionario Piemontese-Italiano, reminds us that "if you're OK where you are, don't move".
The key verb is "bogè" (cf. French "bouger", to move), hence "bogia nen", which is also apparently a nickname for the notoriously set-in-their-ways residents of Turin. A free translation of your phrase might be something like "the reluctant movers who did most moving" (the noun and the verb, which isn't negated, seem to be in the plural).
By the way, most of this comes from long phone call with a Turin-born friend, as well as the above Piedmontese dictionary. I claim no expertise and offer the information "as is"!
Your father must have been a very good and trustworthy person; I can assure you from direct experience, that having a warm relationship whatsoever with a torinese is no mean feat!
Thank you so much for that. It makes a lot of sense. >a humorous reference to something along those lines? Highly likely! This was presented to my father by his colleagues when he left the USIS (US Information Service) in the 1950s to go back to the USA. It was obviously a very warm working relationship.
Welcome to ProZ.com, Amanda! I voted Pro, because you can't find those words in a dictionary. It could be useful to know a bit more about the context; however, bagianell is probably baggiani, which means dumb, simpleminded; bogin is probably bocin, which is a very small lead bullet. Ch'a l'han pi means che non hanno più, who don't have anymore. Could this be about a group of soldiers who had run out of ammunitions, or a humorous reference to something along those lines?
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Answers
3 days 4 hrs confidence:
The reluctant movers who finally moved
Explanation: Amanda very kindly sent me a scanned image of the dedication, which my Turinese friend was able to transcribe in Piedmontese:
I bogianen ch'a l'han pro^ bugià
and translate into Italian:
i "bugianen" che si sono alla fine mossi.
NB Pro^ è un'espressione per rafforzare il concetto.
So the wordplay on the verb "bogè" was in fact the key to the message. My friend had to see the handwriting to decipher that "pro^", though!
Giles Watson Italy Local time: 04:59 Native speaker of: English PRO pts in category: 4
Grading comment
Thank you so much!
Notes to answerer
Asker: Thank you so much for working on this for me. I am constantly astounded at the generous cooperation in the translation world....though it's partly because we are so curious and passionate about solving language-related problems!
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