Glossary entry (derived from question below)
French term or phrase:
histoire sans tête ni queue
English translation:
senseless sitation (here)
Added to glossary by
sporran
Aug 10, 2005 20:40
18 yrs ago
1 viewer *
French term
histoire sans tête ni queue
French to English
Art/Literary
Journalism
idiomatic expression used in Congo newspaper article
"...certaines femmes dotées d'un ésprit faible se laissent entraîner dans des histoires sans tête ni queue..."
Aside from the apparent sexism of this out-of-context chunk (from an article about witchcraft swindles), please can anyone tell me the usual English translation of what I presume to be a standard expression --- I had thought of 'cock-and-bull' or 'without rhyne nor reason', but I think both of those have other standard translations. I thought it was something along the lines of 'story you can make neither head nor tail of', but that doesn't really seem to fit --- they're sort of saying that these gullible women are believing any nonsense they're told, which is why I'd have thought 'cock-and-bull' was closest?
Aside from the apparent sexism of this out-of-context chunk (from an article about witchcraft swindles), please can anyone tell me the usual English translation of what I presume to be a standard expression --- I had thought of 'cock-and-bull' or 'without rhyne nor reason', but I think both of those have other standard translations. I thought it was something along the lines of 'story you can make neither head nor tail of', but that doesn't really seem to fit --- they're sort of saying that these gullible women are believing any nonsense they're told, which is why I'd have thought 'cock-and-bull' was closest?
Proposed translations
(English)
Change log
Aug 10, 2005 21:30: Gayle Wallimann changed "Term asked" from "histoire sans t�te ni queue URGENT!" to "histoire sans t�te ni queue "
Proposed translations
10 mins
French term (edited):
histoire sans t�te ni queue URGENT!
Selected
senseless situations
'histoire' here is a situation, not a story
4 KudoZ points awarded for this answer.
Comment: "Thanks a lot, Sporran, and to all the other answerers, too numerous to thank each individually! But I'm really touched the way you all rallied to my aid.
I'm accepting this answer because Sporran was the first to make me stop and think that of course here 'histoires' is not stories at all, but 'situations' etc. Thanks to Sarah too for making the same observation (and to Bourth for amplifying on it), but I feel it's only fair to give the points to Sporran this time, as he got their first. But this idea was what really helped to unblock me.
The style of the rest of the article suggests that the author did not really intend to spell it out, though he certainly pulled few punches.
Many thanks, again, for ALL your contributions"
+5
9 mins
French term (edited):
histoire sans tкte ni queue URGENT!
a cock and bull story/without rhyme or reason
I think you're right Dusty. The Larousse definition is: denué de sens so nonsensical tales
Peer comment(s):
| agree |
RHELLER
1 min
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| agree |
pascie
: definitely correct. Figure pour "abracadabrante"
31 mins
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| agree |
Gayle Wallimann
42 mins
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| agree |
Sophie Raimondo
: without rhyme or reason...
3 hrs
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| agree |
Estelle Demontrond-Box
13 hrs
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11 mins
French term (edited):
histoire sans t�te ni queue URGENT!
illogical; difficult to sort out
I don't know any better than you but since it's urgent, here's my opinion.
without rhyme or reason sounds just fine
I would not use "cock and bull" which is somewhat vulgar for my prudish ears ;-)
without rhyme or reason sounds just fine
I would not use "cock and bull" which is somewhat vulgar for my prudish ears ;-)
+2
12 mins
French term (edited):
histoire sans t�te ni queue URGENT!
without head nor tail
Declined
Oh Dusty...French people say this every day...all the time..
Peer comment(s):
| agree |
df49f (X)
8 mins
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:) incredible!
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| agree |
Sophie Raimondo
: we usually say "sans queue ni tête"...
3 hrs
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cela revient au même..non?
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Comment: "Thanks, Jane! I have to confess that no-one I know has EVER said this in my presence; odd isn't it?"
13 mins
French term (edited):
histoire sans t�te ni queue URGENT!
stories with neither head nor tail
Vous avez de la chance, je viens de trouver ceci sur l'internet.
"Quelque chose s'etait ranime en lui, et la maniere deroutante avec laquelle il racontait a Boby des histoires sans queue ni tete trahissait une perturbation importante qui s'etait produite en lui, et qui ne devait pas avoir un lien direct avec le voyage (78)."
"Something in him had come back to life, and the confusing way he told Boby stories with neither head nor tail betrayed a serious disturbance that had come about within him, a disturbance that shouldn't have any connection with the journey."
http://www.findarticles.com/p/articles/mi_qa3806/is_199805/a...
"Quelque chose s'etait ranime en lui, et la maniere deroutante avec laquelle il racontait a Boby des histoires sans queue ni tete trahissait une perturbation importante qui s'etait produite en lui, et qui ne devait pas avoir un lien direct avec le voyage (78)."
"Something in him had come back to life, and the confusing way he told Boby stories with neither head nor tail betrayed a serious disturbance that had come about within him, a disturbance that shouldn't have any connection with the journey."
http://www.findarticles.com/p/articles/mi_qa3806/is_199805/a...
+4
14 mins
French term (edited):
histoire sans t�te ni queue URGENT!
they fall for all kinds of crazy scams
histoire is not really a story per se here.
Peer comment(s):
| agree |
Bourth (X)
: Agree, like the Moldavian etc. who fall for promises of waitressing jobs in Paris, end up chained to a bed in Moscow for "breaking in", then God knows where.
13 mins
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thanks Alex
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| agree |
RHELLER
: this is definitely the meaning but not sure if the author meant to "spell it out"
44 mins
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thanks
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| agree |
Sophie Raimondo
: That's the idea
3 hrs
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merci Sophie
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| agree |
Jean-Claude Gouin
5 hrs
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+2
7 mins
Nick Lingris
United Kingdom
United Kingdom
United Kingdom
The word is my oyster
Native in: Greek 
Works in: English to Greek, Greek to English, Greek
French term (edited):
histoires sans t�te ni queue
stories without (a) beginning or (an) end
This would have been my safe rendition.
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Note added at 28 mins (2005-08-10 21:09:23 GMT)
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Le Petit Robert (under \'queue\'):
SANS QUEUE NI TÊTE : qui semble n\'avoir ni début ni fin. Histoire, propos sans queue ni tête. « Improviser de vagues choses extravagantes sans queue ni tête » (Loti). -> incohérent.
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Note added at 28 mins (2005-08-10 21:09:23 GMT)
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Le Petit Robert (under \'queue\'):
SANS QUEUE NI TÊTE : qui semble n\'avoir ni début ni fin. Histoire, propos sans queue ni tête. « Improviser de vagues choses extravagantes sans queue ni tête » (Loti). -> incohérent.
+2
32 mins
French term (edited):
histoire sans t�te ni queue URGENT!
avoid it??
would "fall for (a story)" not convey, or at least help to convey, the messsage, leaving you free to translate the "histoire" bit with something less specific?
These women fall for any old story, fall for crazy stories ...
They are not the only ones, given the numbers of "marabouts" active in France, and not just for African customers! Retour d'affection, gagner aux courses, réussite aux examens .... Strangely, I seem to recall seeing plaques in churches thanking Saint Whoever for making people pass their exams, survive the war ... (or is there a rule here about not talking politics or religion ...?).
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Note added at 33 mins (2005-08-10 21:14:22 GMT)
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Fall for the mumbo jumbo ...
These women fall for any old story, fall for crazy stories ...
They are not the only ones, given the numbers of "marabouts" active in France, and not just for African customers! Retour d'affection, gagner aux courses, réussite aux examens .... Strangely, I seem to recall seeing plaques in churches thanking Saint Whoever for making people pass their exams, survive the war ... (or is there a rule here about not talking politics or religion ...?).
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Note added at 33 mins (2005-08-10 21:14:22 GMT)
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Fall for the mumbo jumbo ...
Peer comment(s):
| agree |
writeaway
: not a bad solution-conveys the actual meaning really well and it sounds less 'translated'.
24 mins
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| agree |
sarahl (X)
: ever heard of plagiarism, Alex? ;-)
3 hrs
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Sorry, should have added an "NFG". That's certainly how it was meant, as support for /elaboration on your answer (with further options). But Dusty doesn't need that spelt out ...
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40 mins
French term (edited):
histoire sans t�te ni queue URGENT!
drift along aimlessly in situations...
depending on the context but this might be good imagery.
Peer comment(s):
| neutral |
RHELLER
: I don't see any relationship
16 mins
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I have to say that you are probably right, upon re-reading the bit of context provided
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48 mins
French term (edited):
histoire sans t�te ni queue URGENT!
'cock-and-bull'
Which means beyond extra-ordinary. J'ai mis le tiret ici pour faire ressortir le sens premier d'ordinaire, l'evolution des le Moyen-Age. Ce n'est pas une faute.
Le mot "Histoires" ici refere a des situations, qui en feront des histoires passionnantes, incroyables,
Un equivalent pourrait etre : a dormir debout, ou la il serait plus judicieux de garder "histoires".
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Note added at 51 mins (2005-08-10 21:31:46 GMT)
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Si l\'on veut rester simple, \'funny\' is a good way of rendering.
Funny situations
Le mot "Histoires" ici refere a des situations, qui en feront des histoires passionnantes, incroyables,
Un equivalent pourrait etre : a dormir debout, ou la il serait plus judicieux de garder "histoires".
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Note added at 51 mins (2005-08-10 21:31:46 GMT)
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Si l\'on veut rester simple, \'funny\' is a good way of rendering.
Funny situations
1 hr
...Which make no sense...
Neither head nor tail,
Senseless stories...
Blah Blah
Senseless stories...
Blah Blah
Discussion
1) They're talking mainly about scams, not love affairs
2) The rest of the article shows a glittering lack of any kind of 'cleverness', I don't think the journalist responsible would be capable of such originality!
As ever, I'll wait the regulation 24 hrs before closing.