| Páxinas no tema: < [1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13] > | Off topic: Does anyone else feel this way? Persoa que publicou o fío: Paulo Roberto
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Liena V. 
Latvia
Local time: 16:30
Membro (2014)
French to Latvian
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| Just love your neighbour and so on | Sep 10, 2025 |
| | | | | Joining the dots (and adding colour) | Sep 11, 2025 |
Even assuming the fruit pickers of southern Italy cannot possibly find other work of any kind to replace those 30 euros a day, despite their innate advantage over immigrants of being local and speaking Italian, and also assuming that the immigrants can return home without being persecuted etc, thus re-establishing the status quo of one group living off 30 euros and the other group having to survive on maybe one euro a day, how is that right? How is that fair? Why are the Italians the priority?... See more Even assuming the fruit pickers of southern Italy cannot possibly find other work of any kind to replace those 30 euros a day, despite their innate advantage over immigrants of being local and speaking Italian, and also assuming that the immigrants can return home without being persecuted etc, thus re-establishing the status quo of one group living off 30 euros and the other group having to survive on maybe one euro a day, how is that right? How is that fair? Why are the Italians the priority?
Put another way, why are the dark-skinned immigrants worth less as human beings than the light-skinned Italians? ▲ Collapse
| | | | Baran Keki
Türkiye
Local time: 16:30
Membro
English to Turkish
| Congratulations Barry! | Sep 11, 2025 |
Your host country Germany (in which you are a migrant) made it to the semifinals in the European Basketball championship, which is not an easy feat!
I was surprised to see so many Black players in the German team (in fact, there were only 3 or 4 white players in their 12-man roster, so the rest were all Black, and weirdly enough, with German sounding names like Schroder, Thiemann, Rüdiger etc.)
So what appeared to be a team of migrants (majority of them were Bl... See more Your host country Germany (in which you are a migrant) made it to the semifinals in the European Basketball championship, which is not an easy feat!
I was surprised to see so many Black players in the German team (in fact, there were only 3 or 4 white players in their 12-man roster, so the rest were all Black, and weirdly enough, with German sounding names like Schroder, Thiemann, Rüdiger etc.)
So what appeared to be a team of migrants (majority of them were Black, mind you) beat all white Slovenia emphatically last night (for what it's worth my money was on Slovenia on the strength of Doncic).
I just thought I'd congratulate you and German colleagues here alike, because, unlike you, I believe in diversity and inclusion. Anyways good result. ▲ Collapse
| | | | mroed (X)
Local time: 15:30
Italian to German
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| the level of discussion is getting low... | Sep 11, 2025 |
Wow, the team from a country with a population of 85 million beats the team from a country with a population of 2 million. If that isn't the ultimate argument for (unregulated migration), I don't know what is!
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Lieven Malaise
Belgium
Local time: 15:30
Membro (2020)
French to Dutch
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mroed wrote:
the level of discussion is getting low...
The level has been low since Gerard thought it was a good idea to spout his xenophobic nonsense while absolutely no-one was asking for it.
After a while exchanging opinions about migration in a civilized way is simply no longer an option when you are dealing with a troll that grasps every occasion to express his frustrations about "woke" society, and to deliberately annoy people that have less despicable, less selfish views.
In a better world, on a better website, this "discussion" wouldn't even have taken place or would have been long removed, but apparently moderation has become a thing of the past.
| | | | Baran Keki
Türkiye
Local time: 16:30
Membro
English to Turkish
| Couldn't help myself | Sep 11, 2025 |
Lieven Malaise wrote:
The level has been low since
Oddly enough, these kinds of (derailed) threads seem to get people more interested than 'how many cups of coffee do you drink a day', 'Wordfast integration with smartwatch' or 'AI this, AI that' kinds of threads, go figure! Perhaps, it's because translation industry is dying fast, and people are no longer getting jobs and losing interest in translation in general (that's excluding people like you of course).
After watching the great game of basketball last night and getting genuinely baffled by the number of black (oops! sorry I meant 'Black'!) players that Germany had, I couldn't help pushing the buttons of that twat. I do apologize for this from other forum members. And to the colleague who made an argument for 'unregulated migration', for a while there one man (the great Luka Doncic) seemed as though he'd take on an entire team by himself. If only he wasn't fouled out..
Screw moderation, we have Icescream back.
| | | | Tom in London
United Kingdom
Local time: 14:30
Italian to English
..... you are dealing with a troll ....
I count at least 2
| | | | Paulo Roberto
Local time: 10:30
English to Portuguese
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INICIO DE TEMA
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Tom in London wrote:
Gerard Barry wrote:
..... immigration at current levels is unsustainable .....
You haven't seen anything yet. Migration is going to increase exponentially in years to some and the idea that it can somehow be stopped is madness.
What you just wrote is utter nonsense. It's a defeatist, fatalist attitude. Of course immigration can be controlled (no one wants to stop it completely). Denmark - under a social democratic government funnily enough - has managed to drastically reduce the numbers of people seeking asylum there. The US is also cracking down on illegal immigration and not before time. Needless to say, some wealthy non-Western countries such as Japan also have very limited immigration. If, on the other hand, countries don't get control over immigration, which you seem to think is fine, then be prepared for further conflict and strife, even violence, over the matter. Like you said, "you haven't seen anything yet".
In other news (ans this isn't really directed at you, Tom, but more at some of the other posters here), I was horrified to read today that right-wing political activist, author, and media personality Charlie Kirk has been murdered in the US, presumably for his political views. I suppose his killer was one of those kind, compassionate woke people we hear about all the time.
| | | | Tom in London
United Kingdom
Local time: 14:30
Italian to English
Gerard Barry wrote:
What you just wrote is utter nonsense.
That's where I stopped reading.
| | | | Sarah Elizab (X)
Italy
Local time: 15:30
Italian to English
| roots and interchangeability | Sep 11, 2025 |
The Shredder wrote:
Even assuming the fruit pickers of southern Italy cannot possibly find other work of any kind to replace those 30 euros a day, despite their innate advantage over immigrants of being local and speaking Italian, and also assuming that the immigrants can return home without being persecuted etc, thus re-establishing the status quo of one group living off 30 euros and the other group having to survive on maybe one euro a day, how is that right? How is that fair? Why are the Italians the priority?
Put another way, why are the dark-skinned immigrants worth less as human beings than the light-skinned Italians?
I don't think these are the right questions, or the right framing. Or at least not always or in every situation.
The seasonal orange picker is local and lives in a village where he has a vast vegetable garden, an orchard, a vineyard, an olive grove, friends and family. They've been there for generations upon generations and have, unlike many others from the same village, chosen to stay rather than move to the north or to Germany or to France etc. because they love life in the village. It's a simple life, but extremely rich in tradition. His other local job options? Maybe 30 euros a day at a restaurant, 20 in a shop. All under the table. Or nothing.
To paraphrase one of your earlier posts, I'm sure that in the case of the migrant doing the job for 20 euros a day, it is not quite how he dreamed of spending his life. But maybe it is. Who's to say? The local orange picker who was doing it for 30 euros was fine with it, though. It was enough to allow him to stay. And, after living there for ten years myself, I can say that although it's not for me, I understand where he's coming from.
Of course, this is in total surely a relatively very very small number of people, when looking at the bigger picture. But how many other 'small stories' like this are there? I never could have so much as imagined this one.
Maybe you'd say the numbers are so small, they don't matter.
In my case, seeing situations like this has given me a more nuanced, complicated perspective and, at the very least, gives me pause.
I'm not writing any of this in the interest of arguing. I'm just trying to contribute a perspective that seems to be missing and that seems to me to be important. Debate, discussion and opposing points of view are great, of course.
[Edited at 2025-09-11 16:08 GMT]
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Yes, that has stalled the commerce of products (internationally as well as within the USA) due to not being profitable any more.
This is from 2 days ago: https://www.inforum.com/business/f-m-chamber-event-explores-chaos-in-the-marketplace-from-tariffs
Tariffs imposed by the Trump administration have resulted in what is essentially the largest tax increase on U.S. businesses and consumers in half a century.
(...)
“If we don’t like some of the trade deals that we have made ... then let’s go and smartly address those one by one, rather than kind of creating this chaos in the marketplace that we have right now,” said Kirchner, who noted about 42,000 manufacturing jobs have been lost in the U.S. since new tariffs started being imposed this year.
Another example from the UN site: https://unctad.org/publication/global-trade-update-september-2025-trade-policy-uncertainty-looms-over-global-markets
Trade policy uncertainty has become a major source of global instability. Sudden shifts in tariffs, subsidies or restrictions fuel volatility.
Policy changes in one country can send shockwaves across the globe, disrupting suppliers, manufacturers and markets. The United States’ recent policy shifts illustrate this.
(...)
For decades, multilateral and regional agreements discouraged abrupt shifts and stabilized flows, with uncertainty mostly limited to episodes like Brexit, COVID-19 or US–China trade tensions. But in 2025, with weakened rules and fierce competition for critical raw materials, uncertainty has soared to record levels.
But history proves that it is always easier (and much faster) to put the blame on the Southern Hemisphere's poor people who feel evicted from their country and forced to work for less than the minimum wage in any Northern Hemisphere country that will accept them (something not easy) just to get a decent meal per day.
And some people here, with superior/university studies (in languages, for sake!), insist that this is just misreading and not an old, trolling, xenophobic speech that has been repeated over and over for at least the last 120 years.
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Maria Laura Curzi wrote:
Yes, that has stalled the commerce of products (internationally as well as within the USA) due to not being profitable any more.
This is from 2 days ago: https://www.inforum.com/business/f-m-chamber-event-explores-chaos-in-the-marketplace-from-tariffs
Tariffs imposed by the Trump administration have resulted in what is essentially the largest tax increase on U.S. businesses and consumers in half a century.
(...)
“If we don’t like some of the trade deals that we have made ... then let’s go and smartly address those one by one, rather than kind of creating this chaos in the marketplace that we have right now,” said Kirchner, who noted about 42,000 manufacturing jobs have been lost in the U.S. since new tariffs started being imposed this year.
Another example from the UN site: https://unctad.org/publication/global-trade-update-september-2025-trade-policy-uncertainty-looms-over-global-markets
Trade policy uncertainty has become a major source of global instability. Sudden shifts in tariffs, subsidies or restrictions fuel volatility.
Policy changes in one country can send shockwaves across the globe, disrupting suppliers, manufacturers and markets. The United States’ recent policy shifts illustrate this.
(...)
For decades, multilateral and regional agreements discouraged abrupt shifts and stabilized flows, with uncertainty mostly limited to episodes like Brexit, COVID-19 or US–China trade tensions. But in 2025, with weakened rules and fierce competition for critical raw materials, uncertainty has soared to record levels.
But history proves that it is always easier (and much faster) to put the blame on the Southern Hemisphere's poor people who feel evicted from their country and forced to work for less than the minimum wage in any Northern Hemisphere country that will accept them (something not easy) just to get a decent meal per day.
And some people here, with superior/university studies (in languages, for sake!), insist that this is just misreading and not an old, trolling, xenophobic speech that has been repeated over and over for at least the last 120 years.
You don't understand where I and Sarah are coming from because you're not in Europe. We are in Europe and are making observations based on what we see. No one blames anyone from a poorer or a war-torn country for trying to improve their lot by emigrating to a richer country. However, this can have downsides for the receiving country if it results in a shortage of housing, wages being suppressed, etc. And then are the cultural and demographic ramifications. I dare say there are currently more practicing Muslims than practicing Christians in some Western European countries nowadays. While I have nothing against Muslims as individuals, surely you can understand why some native Europeans may feel threatened by this and might not be very happy about their own culture being diluted? If not, then I'm afraid you are naive and not really living in the real world.
| | | | Tom in London
United Kingdom
Local time: 14:30
Italian to English
A man with a cigarette telling us how to live. I appreciate the irony
| | | | Tom in London
United Kingdom
Local time: 14:30
Italian to English
| European culture | Sep 12, 2025 |
Gerard Barry wrote:
....I dare say there are currently more practicing Muslims than practicing Christians in some Western European countries nowadays. While I have nothing against Muslims as individuals, surely you can understand why some native Europeans may feel threatened by this and might not be very happy about their own culture being diluted?
Anyone who can say that with a straight face doesn't know anything about European culture. or any culture.
[Edited at 2025-09-12 17:10 GMT]
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